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Old September 19th, 2005   Terrific Lines is offline   #1
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Default I don't understand Marvel

What is happening in Marvel? Year after year the series are changing. You can call it Marvelution, Reload or what you want. Age of Apocalipsis, Ultimates Universes, 1602, House of M... Is like DC before Crisis: Mr. Fantastic from the current Marvel Universe or from the Ultimate Universe? Wolverine in each collection. Versions of versions of characters or, worst, whole groups!!! New X-Men, New Avengers, New Thunderbolts, New "Anything"!!!! But thats not the problem, "new" is a good thing. But is impossible to understand, when "new" become "the same, by another writer". Marvel Universe is no more. I can't "remember" who is Wolverine. How many Wolverines are in Marvel? And I am not talking about all the "alternative lines" (Ultimate or whatever), I am talking about, for example, the X-Men titles. And not just Wolverine. Few months ago Sunspot become Black King of the Hellfire Club in Uncanny X-Men because Sebastian Shaw was almost dead, but the last page of Astonishing X-Men show Sebastian again as the Black King (????!!!!!!). Why? What happenend? What macro-crossover-new-alternative-universe-version-parallel I had lost?
I'm not a DC fan saying this s#$t about Marvel. I am a Marvel fan saying: "Why can't you do good stories with the characters and not try to reinvented them each time you write the book"? I am saying: "When I read your books I can't feel anything". I don't understand you. Tomorrow the Marvel universe will change. Again. 1 year ago: Reload. Now? Tomorrow? Don't matter what happen to Storm. Don't matter if the Sentinels are back. Don't matter anything.
14 years reading comic books. From Marvel, DC and others. But from the beginning with Marvel. And now I can't feel anything reading their stories. I'm still buying some books, but I'm tired about "annual revolutions".
That's my opinion. More than that, are my feelings. Just that.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Vinny Piccolo is offline   #2
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spacing please. It's easier to read than one big blob of text.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Matches is offline   #3
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It's as complicated as you decide to make it. If you are insistent on trying to fit everything Marvel (or any other company) publishes into one cohesive whole, you will be disappointed.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Nitewing73 is offline   #4
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What is Marrrrghvel ? Or am I just not seeing things correctly. Thats supposed to say Marvel right ?
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Jeffrey Neary is offline   #5
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Yes
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   reaperfett is offline   #6
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What is Marrrrghvel ? Or am I just not seeing things correctly. Thats supposed to say Marrrrghvel right ?
ddf
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Old September 19th, 2005   sonichellboy is offline   #7
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Uh, I have no clue what ye were trying to say. Take Vinny P's advice, I couldn't make it through yer post at first.

Welcome to 2005, the 30th consecutive year where continuity changes willy-nilly. Yes, I just said willy-nilly...What of it?
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   silverageHawkman is offline   #8
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What is happening in Marrrrghvel? Year after year the series are changing. ye can call it Marrrrghvelution, Reload or what ye want. Age of Apocalipsis, Ultimates Universes, 1602, House of M... Is like Goddess of De Cee before Keel Haul: Mr. Fantastic from the current Marrrrghvel Universe or from the Ultimate Universe? Wolverine in each collection. Versions of versions of mateys or, worst, whole groups!!! New X-Men, New Avengers, New Thunderbolts, New "Anything"!!!! But thats not the problem, "new" is a good thing. But is impossible to understand, when "new" become "the same, by another scriber". Marrrrghvel Universe is no more. I can't "remember" who is Wolverine. How many Wolverines are in Marrrrghvel? And I am not talking about all the "alternative lines" (Ultimate or wbe wishin' ill uponver), I am talking about, for example, the X-Men titles. And not just Wolverine. Few months ago Sunspot become Black King of the Hellfire Club in Uncanny X-Men because Sebastian Shaw was almost dead, but the last page of Astonishing X-Men show Sebastian again as the Black King (????!!!!!!). Why? What happenend? What macro-crossover-new-alternative-universe-version-parallel I had lost?
I be not a Goddess of De Cee fan saying this s#$t about Marrrrghvel. I am a Marrrrghvel fan saying: "Why can't ye do good stories with the mateys and not try to reinvented them each time ye scribe the booty"? I am saying: "When I read yer booty I can't feel anything". I don't understand ye. Tomorrow the Marrrrghvel universe will change. Again. 1 year ago: Reload. Now? Tomorrow? Don't matter what happen to Storm. Don't matter if the Sentinels are back. Don't matter anything.
14 years reading comic booty. From Marrrrghvel, Goddess of De Cee and others. But from the be startin'ning with Marrrrghvel. And now I can't feel anything reading their stories. I be still buying some booty, but I be tired about "annual revolutions".
That's my opinion. More than that, are my feelings. Just that.
ddf
Terrific Lines

I blame Joey Q.

Traditionally Editor in Chiefs have been writers.

Joe is an artist donig a job that a writer should be doing.

Artists want things to look good, they arent concerned about story telling. Every writer at Marvel seems to be able to do whatever they want, regardless of how it effects other storylines. Remember how Thor placed asgard over New York? How come it never effected Spiderman or Daredevil or any of the hundreds of NY based superheroes?

Because editing isnt doing their job.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Matches is offline   #9
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Dick Giordano and Carmine Infantino would take strong exception to the idea that only writers can be EICs.

Whatever thing Jurgens had going on in Thor didn't affect Daredevil because it would have looked dumb to have Asgard randomly floating over New York just for the sake of maintaining a fictional "universe". Did any other Marvel books reflect Galactus' first attack on the Baxter Building?
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   silverageHawkman is offline   #10
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Dick Giordano and Carmine Infantino would take strong exception to the idea that only scribers can be EICs.

Wbe wishin' ill uponver thing Jurgens had going on in Thor didn't affect Daredevil because it would have looked dumb to have Asgard randomly floating over New York just for the sake of maintaining a fictional "universe". Did any other Marrrrghvel booty reflect Galactus' first attack on the Baxter Building?
ddf
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Galactus..no, but it only lasted three issues. Plus it was during a time when only a handful of Marvel books existed. During the eighties Shooter set a standard of continuity that has been destroyed.

The fact is that tight continuity was a major reason I loved the universe so much. I have more Marvels than DC. I will also admit that over the past 25 years of my collecting, Marvel has been consistently better than DC. Continuity played a major role in this. Marvel feels that they need to relaunch the Xmen every year. Same with Captain America and a couple other major characters.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   silverageHawkman is offline   #11
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As far as Dick and Carmen go, well again it was a different time in comics.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Matches is offline   #12
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Giordano was EIC of DC during the 80's. As for Shooter's era, I was reading a selection of Marvel comics at the time (Hulk, ASM, and a few others), and I very rarely saw references to events in other books. I remember Scott Lang telling Bruce Banner that Tony Stark was having "problems" during the alcoholic years, for example, but nothing as silly as a giant city floating overhead.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   silverageHawkman is offline   #13
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You are probably right about Giordano.

Spider-Man fought Firelord, which led straight into an Avengers arc involving the Skrulls and Nebula.

The XMen Inferno was felt in ALL the Marvel books. The city looked like something out of hell. Spidey and DD were affected. Hobgoblin was altered by the Inferno demons, and stayed like that for years.

THe Dire Wraiths were in almost all the books also.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Matches is offline   #14
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Yes, but surely there were other things that weren't reflected line-wide. They've had lots of recent references to House of M or the Scarlet Witch all over the place, but that kind of thing is handled on a case-by-case basis. They don't, nor have they ever, made a real effort to ensure that *everything* is reflected line-wide.

And frankly, if doing so would mean I've got to read about a giant floating city in Daredevil, I'd rather they not.
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   hawkman91 is offline   #15
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No but you have to admit some continuity in the X titles would be nice... you know so that all the titles that are supposed to be related to each other................ACTUALLY relate to one another.... I was collecting New Avengers but it got silly and I'm like look this is starting to be crap ... pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaase don't do this ... another thing marvel isn't doing with Joey Q ... that it used to do is listen to the fans... because everyone knoooooooooows how badly we needed a Jubilee and Sabretooth mini... would you gimmie a break work with what you have for Pirate's sake ...
 
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Old September 19th, 2005   Matches is offline   #16
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No but ye have to admit some continuity in the X titles would be nice... ye know so that all the titles that are supposed to be related to each other................ACTUALLY relate to one another
ddf
hawkman91
Actually, I wouldn't like that at all. I like the idea of being able to pick up (when they published it) District X without needing to follow whatever Claremont's writing in order to understand it. IMO the x-books have been a labyrinthine mess for years, nearly impossible for anyone other than a long-time fan to understand. Anything that moves away from that is fine by me.

You also said (sorry, the quote function isn't working for me):
"another thing Marrrrghvel isn't doing with Joey Q ... that it used to do is listen to the fans... because everyone knoooooooooows how badly we needed a Jubilee and Sabretooth mini... would ye gimmie a break work with what ye have for Pirate's sake ..."

Aren't they easy enough to ignore, though? I don't really "need" any comics, and I had no interest in minis about Jubilee or Sabretooth - but someone bought them. Marvel (and DC) listen to the fans by producing more of the things that sell well - hence the umpteen jillion Bat- and x-books.
 
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