Spoilers Red Robin #4 Discussion Thread (with Preview)

[moira]

I'm liking this a lot and I am surprised that anyone would call it tedious. I realize that part of the reason I like it is that the story involves this search for what happened to Bruce. But there's more to it than that. Yost is writing well and keeping me engaged with Tim. And where ever the story is going, it is going; it has a sense of purpose and the writer appears to have the plot well thought out.

There was some speculation, due to where the first boy and the last boy on earth were located, that Batman might be on Earth 51. There was a plausible guess but it would now appear to be wrong, given where Tim found the Bat.

And in the box...was that SPOILER. Highlight below text to read

a batarang in stone?

[superboy650]

The story has been engaging, of course part of that might be that I find the character of Tim very engaging, but at the same time I don't like this status quo over his old status quo and thus find the entire "new" Batman thing a waste of my time.

stephbarton v.2

I don't find this "new status quo" thing that far off from the old. It is Tim on his own adventure, although as RED Robin, which we were starting to get the darker grimmer Tim anyway before Battle for the Cowl. The "new Batman thing" I hear people complain about is providing us with new and interesting stories, whether it's how to handle a Bruce Wayne impersonator, Dick as Batman (albeit again, but different), and Tim becoming influenced by Ra's as Damien is influenced by Dick.

[oddballuk]

I really liked the issue.

The interactions between Tim and Ra's assassins were even better this issue and the reveal in the cave, while inevitable, was very cool anyway.

Hell of a cliffhanger!

Council of Spiders? Interesting!

[DarkeSword]

What I really love about this series is that even though Tim is going all dark and crossing lines and compromising his values, you really get a sense that he's not okay with the fact that he's doing it. He doesn't try to rationalize what he's doing beyond a hope that the ends will eventually justify the means. I like that Tim at least recognizes what he's doing is really in a gray area; it really helps me as a reader identify with him. I sit there and I read this and I think, "Oh God, Tim, what are you doing?" and at the same time, he says, "Oh God, what am I doing?"

Other bits I liked in this ish:
- Z's motivation for helping Tim. It's a shame he got run through like that; I would have liked to see more of him.
- The cave scene.
- Tim talking about how he always liked that Ra's called Bruce "the Detective." I have to agree; I've always loved that.

[CatsMeow]

Does Lucius Fox's daughter have a name yet?

[E2Brutus]

This issue didn't really feel like a conclusion to a four-part story, it felt like just another chapter, but that's okay.

CatsMeow

I agree--by definition a cliffhanger isn't a conclusion. The naming was odd here. If they'd called it "Grail part 4" I'd be fine, but this was in no way a "conclusion" to anything.

Other than that I liked the issue. It's definitely keeping me interested; I wasn't sure that would happen after the whole changeover.

[Velocity9]

I loved that scene in the cave. The fact that even Tim has been wondering if he's crazy for the last three issues, for him to find that cave, to have that major victory was amazing, built up wonderfully by Yost, who has instilled this series with a clear purpose and goal, and that really adds to the rest of the story.

I liked seeing what Iraq in the DCU looks like. Kinda cool to see something set there, not as a major focus, but as a cool setting point, but Tim could take down some soldiers, I rarley see US Soldiers swing from buildings, fight sludge monsters and do backflips while doing it.... Just saying.

[.osid]

Does Lucius Fox's daughter have a name yet?

CatsMeow

Tam Fox is her name...Christopher Yost interview if haven't already read...

http://robot6.comicbookresources.com...istopher-yost/

Marcus To starts penciling Red Robin with issue #6...

http://www.marcusto.com/

[MattDiCarlo]

I don't think this book is getting enough credit. I suppose I can see why. you put it up against Batman & Robin or Detective Comics and it seems sort of lacking.

But I really think it's something that the DCU has mostly been missing. It's a smart little comic that uses continuity well in the name of character development.

[CatsMeow]

I don't think this book is getting enough credit. I suppose I can see why. you put it up against Batman & Robin or Detective Comics and it seems sort of lacking. But I really think it's something that the DCU has mostly been missing. It's a smart little comic that uses continuity well in the name of character development.

MattDiCarlo

I agree. My only qualm is that the third issue showed Tim in the Red Robin costume during Final Crisis when he was still in the traditional Robin suit, but that's a relatively minor art goof.

[SageShinigami]

Still not feeling it. I still feel like Tim's not given enough respect--the idea that he couldn't have made it past all those things--alone--is a bit ridiculous considering world-hopping was one of the things he did best back when he was much younger and much less experienced. To say nothing of the fact that those League of Assassin guys were never truly in his (excuse the pun) league to begin with. Not even the "Z" character. Sorry, but Tim's faced dozens of highly-trained assassins before and come out just fine.

However, I approve of the fact that, if nothing else, Yost isn't forgetting to address anything. He doesn't just pretend the guy's normal supporting cast doesn't exist anymore to tell this "Darker and Edgier" Tim Drake story, which is good.

Him finding the cave was very nice. One of the few people I actually discuss comics with discussed this book's purpose early on, and mostly felt the story would go like this:

- Tim goes around the world on essentially a "vacation", teaming up with various people to defeat random villains.
- He finds nothing.
- Heads back to Gotham with no clues, but still optimistic about Bruce's return.

Shockingly though, he found the drawing. Very nice.

This really does not feel like the Tim Drake I grew up with, but every month I find reasons to excuse his behavior given that the guy has been through the wringer. But I still want the old Tim to make a comeback.

Also: The upcoming artist change will be welcome. Ramon Bachs isn't terrible, but I prefer somewhat more dynamic art for Robin, even if they are making him edgier.

BTW--thanks for the interview. I hadn't noticed it on CBR when they released it.

[SmilingKnight]

Still not feeling it. I still feel like Tim's not given enough respect--the idea that he couldn't have made it past all those things--alone--is a bit ridiculous considering world-hopping was one of the things he did best back when he was much younger and much less experienced. To say nothing of the fact that those League of Assassin guys were never truly in his (excuse the pun) league to begin with. Not even the "Z" character. Sorry, but Tim's faced dozens of highly-trained assassins before and come out just fine.

SageShinigami

This was shown in the first issue, the three assassins thought they could take them and got their butts kicked for the effort. And yeah, even Tim knows he should have made it past that check point without the League, he screwed up cause he's moving too fast and taking risks that he shouldn't, maybe so he doesn't have to time to think about the compromises he's making?

Whatever's happening I'm enjoying it.